Daryl Cagle: I'm Daryl Cagle and this is the CagleCast where we're all
about editorial cartoons and we have four great cartoonists with us today.
We've got, Bart van Leeuwen, who lives and works as a freelancer in
Amsterdam, Holland, where he specializes in editorial illustration, does lots
of advertising, and he does photo realistic editorial cartoons for us.
And, he is just amazing.
And it's nice to have you here, Bart.
Thank you.
Likewise.
Yeah, Dave Whamond is Incredibly prolific.
He draws two comics, Reality Check and Day by Dave.
And he's a prolific illustrator also.
He does puzzles and greeting cards and lots of top selling children's books.
And great to have you here with us, Dave.
Great.
Thanks for having me.
Pat Burns is best known for his cartoons in The New Yorker.
And he draws all kinds of gag cartoons for other magazines.
He did a comic strip for years called Monkey House.
And he's an advertising illustrator.
And he has won a bunch of awards as well.
Thank you.
And Rick McKee was the cartoonist for decades for the
Augusta Chronicle in Georgia.
He draws the comic strip, Pluggers, and we've syndicated Rick for 20 years.
Rick, great to have you here.
Good to be here.
Thanks, Daryl.
So Bart, we're starting off with you.
Here you've got, Trump with the ghost of Christmas future
looking at himself in jail.
I think that's very funny.
Yeah, I thought so, too.
Rick McKee: I
Bart van Leeuwen: mean, it's a very simple concept and I've probably done a
thousand times, but, uh, I like simple concepts and reminds me of my youth a lot
when I watched those movies all the time.
Daryl Cagle: this cartoon is also optimistic and
aspirational
Rick McKee: Yes, we can, we can all hope.
Yeah.
there a lot of interest in American politics you live?
Bart van Leeuwen: yeah, there especially, when, when, uh, in the Trump period.
And, and, uh, yeah, the newspapers, all the newspapers here as, uh, have,
their correspondents in America.
So There's a big influence.
Daryl Cagle: So Pat, Pat, you've got a Trump Scrooge cartoon.
Trump says, but you can't be Jacob Marley's ghost.
I pardon Jacob Marley's ghost.
That's very funny.
Well,
Rick McKee: thank
Pat Byrnes: you.
it's, it's, it's hard not to find the comparisons.
Except, Trump, did not.
Reform the way Scrooge did, and likely never will.
All right.
That's a downer.
Daryl Cagle: Dave, here's your Trump Christmas.
He's, given the kids beautiful, clean coal Charlie Brown Christmas kind of promises.
And he says, my tree is the best tree.
Probably the most fantastic tree anyone has ever seen.
I that I can tell you.
that's fun.
Dave Whamond: think this is one of the first ones I did for you, it's
like, this goes way back, I think.
I think what, 2018, somewhere in there, 2019.
Daryl Cagle: Well, you know, we've had a lot of Trump Christmases it's really kind
of amazing that we can do a whole podcast with 40 cartoons, all about Trump and
Christmas, and, They're all good cartoons.
so this is our, Trump Christmas special.
you know, the only podcasts we do that anyone seems to care about
are the ones with Trump cartoons.
we love Christmas and everybody loves Trump.
So, uh, What a great podcast this will be.
Trump's
Dave Whamond: the, uh, brings us cartoonists lots of goodies
Daryl Cagle: throughout the year.
Bart van Leeuwen: So, he's a very inspiring person, right?
Daryl Cagle: Here's one of mine with Trump mistletoe.
I think this is actually kind of a Yahtzee with all of the
elephants kissing Trump's butt.
many of the cartoonists have done this.
Including Rick!
Although, uh, Rick had the good taste to not drop Trump's pants, I'm sure that
Rick's cartoon got reprinted a heck of a lot more than my cartoon got reprinted.
Okay, so we're going to go through some of Rick's cartoons.
Rick actually has more Trump Christmas cartoons than any of the
other cartoonists that we syndicate.
Pat Byrnes: Put that on your resume.
Daryl Cagle: Yeah.
told you my reputation was ruined.
is your wheelhouse.
So, Sam is bringing Trump and Biden back to the returns.
the gal at return says, it's usually customary to wait
until after the holidays.
This is very funny.
Rick McKee: It's sort of an old gag.
You know, everybody kind of does it.
But I thought, this is actually my most recent cartoon.
just uploaded it a couple of days ago.
Dave Whamond: it's always good when you have Biden and Trump in and then the
papers, uh, reprinted a lot more that way.
So,
Daryl Cagle: yes, they like to feel even handed.
you know, the whole idea of being even handed is just kind of crazy.
don't know that there's any virtue to being even handed.
Rick McKee: Yeah.
And I don't, I don't see this necessarily as being even handed.
And a lot of people have criticized me for saying that I
was, to make a false equivalency.
And I think the facts are, most voters, want somebody new from both
parties, and I don't think that's necessarily trying to be even handed.
It's just sort of a fact.
Daryl Cagle: It seems like everybody says that every year,
but it's more true this year.
Rick McKee: think so.
I mean, know, two thirds Democrats want somebody other than Biden.
You can't say the.
necessarily the same thing about Trump.
But I think pretty much everybody wants Trump gone, outside
of His hardcore supporters.
so that's just where I was coming from on that.
Daryl Cagle: So here you've got Santa talking to his elves of the coal mine
and santa says Trump kept his promise.
He single handedly brought back my coal industry
Pat Byrnes: How do you know that, how do you know that, why do people go
pretend that Santa has a deep voice?
Santa could have a really high voice.
Like Lincoln.
Everyone does the Lincoln with a deep voice.
No, he had a real high voice.
It was the same with Santa.
Come on.
Rick McKee: Lincoln had a high voice?
Mix it up.
Daryl Cagle: he really have a high voice, Lincoln?
Yes,
Pat Byrnes: it was described as like a little girl.
Wow!
Uh, and Santa's up there in the cold and like, woof!
Rick McKee: Well, one of the, uh, one of the things that I sort of do, and I
don't know if it'll show up, in any of my other cartoons, but, many years When I was
drawing, a Santa and Elf cartoon, you'll notice this one has a, my little elf there
in the bottom is smoking a cigarette, because, uh, I always try to get
an elf smoking a
cigarette in these, in these cartoons, because, you know, they're, they're grown
men, really, they're not little kids, so.
I always thought it was a funny little thing to drop in.
Daryl Cagle: That's very funny.
So I, I have once in a while heard of papers, our papers, I forget
which ones, having policies that they will not reprint any cartoons
that depict gun or a cigarette.
Wow, okay.
Dave Whamond: So most of them didn't notice it
Daryl Cagle: probably, so.
Yeah.
Rick McKee: Yeah.
You don't
Daryl Cagle: expect an
Rick McKee: elf to be smoking.
Daryl Cagle: So, here you've got, Santa looking at his phone at Trump's
tweet that says, Santa Claus is a loser, head of a toy company failing
so badly, asking if the toys away, sad!
And Elf says, I warned you not to put Trump on the naughty list.
Dave Whamond: Rick always does the ideas that I wish I thought of.
Daryl Cagle: Ah, I appreciate that, Dave.
Rick McKee: that's an old one.
And, that one got passed around.
That was back when Trump was still on Twitter or X whatever we're calling it
these days..
Daryl Cagle: So at the end of Obama's administration, he's looking at his
legacy sock and he sees Trump coal.
you didn't like Obama.
. yeah, I mean, uh, at this, at this time, were you more optimistic about Trump?
Rick McKee: I think I was just sort of more realistic about Trump I think, you
know, everything that, Obama did and tried to do, was about to be trashed by Trump.
yeah, I worked for many years for probably the most conservative
newspaper in the South.
So, you know, I did a lot of, I did a lot of conservative stuff.
But, you know, Trump came along and completely changed the Republican Party.
I don't, I don't even think you can call it conservative anymore.
It's just all, all Trump.
Daryl Cagle: And here you have Trump as Ralphie, he was fighting the government
shutdown every time it came up, like we seem to be doing in perpetuity.
You'll shoot your eye out, kid!
Rick McKee: Yeah, except for Trump was saying at the time, I don't know
if you recall, but he was saying, I'll shut the government down.
he wanted to, he wanted to do it and take credit for it.
Um, which, and he did, I think it lasted about two or three days, and he
saw which way the wind was blowing on that, and they reversed But, it was the
most amazing thing me that this moron wanted to shut the government down.
Pat Byrnes: that's when you really crossed over in a bizarro world.
Dave Whamond: Yeah, I think he has a lot of yes people around him
telling that's a great idea, sir.
Right suddenly.
I'll see three days later Oh, gee,
Pat Byrnes: right.
It was a good idea you
Rick McKee: Yeah,
then he'll deny that he ever did it or said it.
Daryl Cagle: so here's Trump sitting on Santa's lap and Santa
says have you been a good boy this year and Trump says witch hunt
Rick McKee: Yeah, that was typical, Trump blame everybody.
If you notice my elf has a cigarette.
You
Daryl Cagle: know, by the end of this podcast, everybody's going to associate
Trump with warm Christmas spirit.
That's right.
Yeah.
So here is Santa talking on the phone, the red phone, he's
looking at the Christmas list.
It says, my Christmas list, overturn election, 270 electoral votes, not
to be a loser, my little conspiracy theory kit, my enemies heads on pikes.
And Santa says, no, I'm sorry.
I can't do any of this.
What?
No, I'm afraid you can't fire me, Donald.
No, I'm
Pat Byrnes: afraid you can't fire me, Donald.
Come
on, get with it!
Uh,
Rick McKee: you can do the next, the next Santa, I thought this was very funny.
This is Pat Bagley.
That's great.
it's interesting how many, Christmas story movie cartoons there are.
People really, people really bond with that.
It's such a great
time of year for metaphors and imagery and For sure.
Daryl Cagle: Bart, here's one of yours.
Trump got an abacus for Christmas to help him count the ballots.
He just can't get to add up right.
think that's cute.
I thought so
Bart van Leeuwen: too.
think the only way to downsize Trump is to make him some
sort of, like, a cute person.
Like a baby.
So yeah, that's what I did.
Daryl Cagle: I guess this is about as cute as you can make him.
Pat Byrnes: I find it hard to believe that he would know how to use abacus though.
I mean that's pretty advanced technology.
Bart van Leeuwen: Well not, well as a baby.
Not as a grown up, but as a baby, uh, probably, so yeah.
Daryl Cagle: Well, you see from his expression that he's not
making any sense of the math.
That's true.
The answer is just obviously cannot be right.
Bart van Leeuwen: He's not making sense of anything, I guess.
Dave Whamond: He thinks they're Skittles, he's trying to eat them,
Daryl Cagle: that's what it looks like.
So here, here Trump is Peering into the McDonald's window like the
toy store window at Christmastime.
It's a McDonald's window.
It was in
Bart van Leeuwen: the shutdown period, the first shutdown period.
Daryl Cagle: So when there was the COVID shutdown, he was yearning for the
McDonald's that he could no longer have.
Bart van Leeuwen: Yes, exactly.
Daryl Cagle: I know around the rest of the world, people look at McDonald's
and they think America, but here in America, we look at McDonald's and
we think, just think McDonald's.
it's no, uh, patriotic association with McDonald's.
Bart van Leeuwen: You more like Burger King?
Or Kentucky Fried Chicken?
Kentucky Fried Fried Chicken
Daryl Cagle: or whatever.
I don't know.
Is there any restaurant you think of in Holland as being patriotic or se or
associated with your national identity?
Bart van Leeuwen: Yeah, the Febo,
Daryl Cagle: Sebo?
Bart van Leeuwen: Febo, FEBO.
. Rick McKee: What are, what do they, what do they
have?
Bart van Leeuwen: Uh, it's an automatic where you you can get, uh, Coqueta
and you can get, uh, free Candela.
And, also burgers and you just have to, put in a coin and
then you can, uh, pull it out.
Daryl Cagle: It's like an automat.
Bart van Leeuwen: Yeah.
It's an automat.
It's typically Dutch, not automatic, but the concept of
snacks out of the, out of the wall.
it's also has a kind of a cult status right now because it,
Daryl Cagle: yeah.
Well I know if I saw Frikadella on the menu, I'd want that.
Yeah, exactly.
Okay.
Dave Whamond: I was just gonna say in Canada, our national
identity is Tim Hortons.
I don't know if you guys have heard of that, but it's like a Dunkin Donuts.
Yeah.
Daryl Cagle: So I
Pat Byrnes: grew up in Detroit and still go back.
So they have Tim Hortons in Detroit.
Dave Whamond: Right, right.
think they tried to expand and that's as far as they got down the
top part of the northern border,
Daryl Cagle: so
So Pat, here's one of yours.
It doesn't have Trump in it, but it has guns so close enough and The wise
men are bringing the guns and ammo and myrrh to Baby Jesus, that's so sweet.
That's great.
Oh the tradition
Pat Byrnes: was gonna have my AR 15 in the background here, but you
know, somebody's already done that.
So,
Daryl Cagle: yes, we have a conservative cartoonist who on our podcast displays
his AR 15 behind him all the time.
And, you just have to watch all the podcasts to find that it's an Easter egg.
And here we have a couple holidays.
Yes, January 6th, the new, far right Christian holiday.
And you've got, uh, the MAGA hat guy talking to his, daughter, and he says,
This is the day the MAGA followed a reality TV star to the east with grifts
of gold, frank nonsense, and merch.
That's good.
And she says, I just had an epiphany.
I think that's funny.
Dave Whamond: That's perfect.
Pat Byrnes: It's a lot of cheap puns.
Kind of.
Yeah.
Once I found Frank Nonsense and merch, I thought, all right, I gotta do it now.
I started with the GIFs of the MAGA, but That's what
Dave Whamond: happens when you have a good pun in your head, you can't
not do it right once it's there.
It's like, okay, I gotta
Daryl Cagle: find this pun.
That's So here you have the gal shopping on Black Friday, and she's
shopping on Cyber Monday, and she's, Giving on her phone on Giving Tuesday,
and then she's broke Wednesday.
Bart van Leeuwen: Yeah, I like this.
I like this one.
Daryl Cagle: is reality.
Yeah,
Rick McKee: it wasn't
Pat Byrnes: this like a week and a half ago that the emails were just flooding in.
was brutal.
Daryl Cagle: I'm still getting it.
Everybody begging for money at the same time each year.
would think that if they would space it out, they'd get a little bit of response
rather than all this competition at once.
Yeah, I don't know.
Yeah, no kidding.
here you've got, uh, Trump and he's, giving the gift of NATO funding
cuts to Putin, and Putin says, Oh, Donald, for me, how did you know?
Donald says, I really shouldn't have.
Rick McKee: Those are great caricatures,
Daryl Cagle: Dan.
Oh, thanks,
Dave Whamond: thanks.
I struggle with caricatures, but I'm starting to figure
it out a little bit now, so.
Daryl Cagle: I don't think anybody knew that you struggled with caricature.
Dave Whamond: So this, I think this goes way back.
It's almost hard to remember all the things that happened
in the Trump presidency.
So sometimes I see these cartoons, it's like, oh yeah, NATO funding cuts.
I forgot all
Daryl Cagle: about that.
now, we have such a rich tradition of Trump cartoons that allows us to do a
gazillion podcasts of everybody's Trump cartoons, just because there are so many.
After all these years, and it looks like it's not abating, you know, a lot of
these things we tend to forget about, like, his threats to pull out of, of
NATO, and I guess he'll want to pull out of Ukraine as well, and he's mad
at Netanyahu and Israel, and he would, he would, uh, not support that, and,
it's just, Trump is the isolationist.
now.
He'll support all the dictators so there's no conflicts with them.
He was the isolationist.
I think that's all
Pat Byrnes: very scary.
He was the isolationist before, and kind of makes you wonder in retrospect,
was the big tax cut for the rich, which ballooned our deficit, was that
a strategic move, maybe suggested to him by somebody else, in this cartoon?
So that downstream, when some would say, I don't know, Ukraine would need assistance,
people, you know, Putin allies could say, Oh, well, you know, we just don't
have, we don't have the money for it.
We can't, we can't support that.
I mean, look, there's a deficit
Daryl Cagle: that's part of being anti government.
You choke off the resources and then you have to get rid of the government.
Dave Whamond: And I think Putin thought Trump might get the second
term, and I think that's when the NATO he would have walked out of NATO.
That's what of the speculation is.
Didn't happen.
A
Pat Byrnes: lot of the speculation is based on things that Trump
literally said, so yeah, it's not deep speculation, although big ass for his
gear, you can't always believe the guy.
Dave Whamond: No, never noticed that before.
That's the truth.
You pointed that out, right?
That's
noticed a lot of the quotes now that are coming back and they're playing Trump.
He's saying that that's AI, that he didn't actually say it.
So, you
Rick McKee: know, but you know, we laugh about that now, but that
is going to become a real problem.
And I guarantee you his, his people, his cultists are going to believe that.
Yeah, he said it.
They're going to believe it.
You won't be able to trust anything and he'll just be able to say,
didn't do that, that was AI.
Yeah,
Pat Byrnes: he can say it in the very next sentence and deny what he
just said and people go, oh yeah.
They can try to hold
Rick McKee: him to it.
kind of a scary, it's not kind of a scary place we're getting, it is terrifying.
Daryl Cagle: So, Dave, here's one of yours with Trump and Melania, and Trump says,
Look, Melania, is that the Christmas star?
And Melania says, no, Donald, it's an asterisk.
You know, there was a period there where all the cartoonists
were drawing asterisk cartoons.
Like, you know, the baseball player gets caught with steroids.
He's not in the baseball book except he's got an asterisk that says, he
hit this mini, but he was taking drugs, so we don't really count it.
but I think that was also optimistic and aspirational because it doesn't
seem to look that way, I guess it's kind of, charming to look back on our
innocence of these days, to look at the asterisk cartoons and think that we
thought history would read it that way.
Dave Whamond: I can add, like, five or six more asterisks up there now.
Daryl Cagle: Four indictments.
Pat Byrnes: If we bring Trump back, then we should realize that it is our asterisk.
Daryl Cagle: Yes, all the voters have an asterisk.
Here's one of mine.
Trump on Christmas morning, he says, now I want everything else.
is that from, Daryl?
What's it from?
When?
probably six years old, seven years old.
Rick McKee: you can see, our year Trump has changed through the years.
get it, all of our, all of our,
Daryl Cagle: Yeah, Trump, Trump evolves.
You know, I, in New York in the 70s and 80s and Trump was a big New York
figure and he was, skinny, he was tall and skinny and it was difficult for
me to change my image of him to being fat, He was just skinny in my mind, I
look back at my first Trump cartoons when he should have been fat, and he's
too skinny in my cartoon, and it looks so wrong, and it makes me cringe.
Rick McKee: And he
Bart van Leeuwen: also was in the Home Alone 2 movie, right?
Yes, he
Rick McKee: was.
Daryl Cagle: here's Trump on Santa's lap and he's got the line of kids behind him
with their lists waiting for him with his long list and he says, I want a big
beautiful wall and send these losers back to where they came from and that
naughty list of yours is fake news sad.
Bart van Leeuwen: I like the way you draw the kids.
Daryl Cagle: Yeah.
This is Brian Adcock, British cartoonist in our group, who
isn't drawing much anymore.
I miss him.
And he's got Santa giving the tax cuts to the fat cats.
That's Santa Trump under there!
Dave Whamond: I love those fat cats.
Those are great.
Daryl Cagle: we don't see fat cats anymore decades ago editorial
cartoons were full of fat cats.
And, I don't think kids, kids know who fat cats are.
Yeah.
Bart van Leeuwen: Garfield.
Pat Byrnes: right.
Garfield ruined it for
Daryl Cagle: everyone.
This one's from Angel Bolligan, and he's got Trump with the classic
cartoon dunce cap, but it's all, don't likes from the internet.
Rick McKee: Angel is just a master of line work and composition.
I agree.
Daryl Cagle: Yeah, this is kind of, I don't know how to describe it.
Very
Bart van Leeuwen: sinister also, all of his drawings.
Very sinister.
Sinister?
Yeah, sinister.
Rick McKee: He's got a real editorial illustration feel to everything.
you know, not necessarily cartoonish, but Just very, very
timeless and classic, Yeah, very
Daryl Cagle: unique approach.
this is an idea I never would have thought of.
it's out of the range of, the normal editorial cartoonist cliché palette.
More
Bart van Leeuwen: of an artistic, uh, approach.
Daryl Cagle: Here's one from Patrick Chapatte, the Swiss cartoonist.
And he's got Trump giving his tax cut as he's sitting on the shoulders
of the poor to give it to the rich.
I like that.
Yeah, that's good.
I have a son in, in a younger generation and, his friends just despise Biden
and they kind of like Trump and I think that's just crazy and I ask him
why and he says, the friends say Trump sent them checks and Biden didn't and
they have all this inflation now with Biden and they can't get jobs and the
only jobs are lousy, but when Trump was president, he sent them checks I think
that, that's kind of, profound because I would have never thought of that.
Yeah.
Dave Whamond: And that like with Biden's infrastructure, you don't see it till 10
years down the road and then you might not attribute it to him anyway, so.
If you get the check in your hand, you know,
Daryl Cagle: and Trump could
Pat Byrnes: go way out of his way to get his name on those relief
checks during the pandemic.
Rick McKee: Well, to Dave's point.
I'm sorry, go ahead.
Pat Byrnes: it was, it was decried as highly irregular and of
Rick McKee: corrupt at the time.
was just going to say to Dave's point about the infrastructure and, you know,
10 years from now, I mean, you don't have to wait for 10 years from now
because you saw all these MAGA Republican congressmen going out there touting the
infrastructure in their home districts.
That they voted against.
know.
Daryl Cagle: Also, I think you can ascribe a lot of the inflation
now to Trump's crazy spending.
because there's a lag to all of this.
you know, it's very much a, what have you done for me lately and what are
things like right now perception.
And Biden comes out very poorly on that.
Pat Byrnes: Well, it's the old thing about him.
know, you, when you try to invest in something like, saving your house,
you got a leaky roof and, you know, there's the old gag about, why don't
you fix it when it's not raining?
Because, well, because it's not dripping and, people don't get that you got to
invest in country in its infrastructure to keep it going, to keep it thriving.
Yeah, we got some.
Messed up attitudes.
Yeah.
Dave Whamond: he's got the label of, with the inflation and gas prices
and their people are still talking about them, but it's not that bad now.
I hear the inflation rate's quite down and, he's still wearing that
Daryl Cagle: label.
it's down, but it doesn't seem that way, to regular folks, you know, you
go out to dinner and you see the prices on the menu going up every single time.
So, here we've got John Cole, and he's drawn Trump at the Starbucks
holding the paper that says, Boycott Starbucks, Red Cups, War on Christmas.
And the Starbucks barista says, Okay, one vinty double whipped up espresso
of phony outrage with extra foam at the mouth and a shot of sanctimony for Donald.
I think that's funny.
Dave Whamond: I never got the whole war on Christmas thing, like, you know, I
think it was just a kind of an invented problem, maybe, maybe it is more down
there, I don't know, but, It isn't.
Daryl Cagle: Yeah.
Yeah.
It isn't.
Pat Byrnes: it's anything to feel persecuted.
Daryl Cagle: Yes, they, they really have to support the, victimhood
and that takes constant, feeding to, to feed the victimhood.
Pat Byrnes: and if it's like, if you show respect for someone
who's not you, then that, somehow comes out of their respect bank.
Yeah.
Then take something from them, which is
Daryl Cagle: what?
Dave Whamond: And I remember at one point Trump was saying, thanks to me,
now everyone can say Merry Christmas again, and I just thought, you know, you
can't write a funnier cartoon than that.
Rick McKee: And that's the problem with Trump.
You cannot exaggerate him.
You can't satirize him.
And, just like you said, I mean, What an incredibly stupid thing to say.
Now everybody can say Merry Christmas, thanks to me.
Dave Whamond: you know what?
It sticks with his base.
They eat that stuff up, so.
Daryl Cagle: Oh, they believe it, yeah.
Oh, yeah.
here's one from J.
D.
Crow.
New from Starbucks.
The Trumpuccino Foam Over.
I think that's funny too.
That's cute.
That's good.
like it.
not sure that it makes any point.
It's just a funny hair cartoon.
Yeah, it's a, it's a comb over character.
here is from, uh Jos Collignon, your cartoonist colleague in Holland.
Bart van Leeuwen: Yes.
Daryl Cagle: And, uh, Trump is, is flying up behind, the angel who's,
Talking to shepherds and says, fear not for behold, I bring you good fake news.
Pat Byrnes: that's a great perspective for a shot for framing shot.
Daryl Cagle: It's the funniest thing on this is the sheep looking up.
Rick McKee: Yeah, everybody's appalled.
Dave Whamond: Yeah, I love the drawing too.
It's got sort of a Pat Oliphant kind of feel to it.
It's very, very nice.
Rick McKee: Definitely, definitely
Daryl Cagle: So here's John Darkow.
John Darkow came in number two on number of Trump Christmas cartoons to you, Rick.
Oh, okay.
Santa with Trump on his knee is saying, You're not on the naughty
list, you are the naughty list.
Oh no, I'm sorry, Pat was going to read this one.
Pat, could you read this one for us?
Pat Byrnes: You're not on the naughty list, you are the naughty list.
Rick McKee: Yeah, very good.
Daryl Cagle: So here's Bob Engelhardt.
He's got Trump on Santa's knee and Trump says, Give me everything I
want or I'll release devastating classified information about you, Romeo.
Rick McKee: And he got the, little toilet paper stuck to
Daryl Cagle: his foot.
That's a nice touch.
I like it.
this is Frank Hansen and he's got Trump with a present.
Puppet of himself saying, merry covfefe.
I like the way this looks.
I don't entirely understand it.
Um, you remember like for a month, everyone was talking about covfefe,
which was obviously Trump mistyped coffee into his phone, but everybody
thought that was just hilarious.
and we had, dozens of covfefe cartoons and they were on, Saturday
Night Live talking about covfefe.
And, that's just, that's just crazy.
There's so many, substantive reasons to ridicule him than a typo.
Yeah, the
Pat Byrnes: substance doesn't seem to stick on him.
No.
Rick McKee: It's all,
Daryl Cagle: you know.
but the covfefe did stick.
Yeah.
Pat Byrnes: Because it was just that dumb.
Dave Whamond: I love, uh, Frank's, gestural drawings.
They're, I think they're Quite outstanding.
Daryl Cagle: Yeah, look at the, the hair on the gal that's
drinking the black liquid.
that's really very stylish.
he's got a wonderful style.
Pat Byrnes: A lot of energy.
Daryl Cagle: And you know in an editorial cartoon you really don't
anything more than energy and attitude.
because this cartoon is fun and compelling and, doesn't really make any point.
but that's not
necessary.
A point can be handy if it's, you know, an editorial cartoon.
Rick McKee: Maybe I'm old
school.
Daryl Cagle: Alright, uh, here's another one of your,
colleagues from the Netherlands,
Bart.,
Bart van Leeuwen: Yeah, I love his, uh, I love his abstractistic style.
Daryl Cagle: This is Joep Bertrams, and, I've got to ask you, this
is Trump, I guess choking on a big dollar sign, sausage.
Is this a Christmas thing in Holland, a big sausage?
Bart van Leeuwen: no, not really.
Rick McKee: Is that a, a figgy pudding by chance?
The sausage,
Daryl Cagle: you think it's a figgy pudding?
Rick McKee: I don't know.
I'm not exactly sure what they look like, but it does look
like a sausage, I don't know.
Daryl Cagle: And I suppose that this dollar sausage is somehow
related to air pollution.
Yeah,
Dave Whamond: lots of drool around the mouth there too.
You're saying Daryl editors don't like.
Cartoons with drool in it, so.
Daryl Cagle: They don't like any kind of bodily fluid, including drool and spit.
and I'm sure they don't like, large sausage shaped things stuck in mouths.
Pat Byrnes: Everything about this drawing is so wrong, I love it.
Um,
Rick McKee: I thought that,
Daryl Cagle: this being from Holland, that you might be
able to explain it to us, Bart.
Bart van Leeuwen: No.
No.
Rick McKee: No.
No.
Full stop.
Daryl Cagle: No.
Bart van Leeuwen: Does it, does it have to?
Okay.
Daryl Cagle: No.
Again.
This is, this is another odd one.
But from Marion Kaminsky in Austria.
you've got the manger scene with Trump and Putin with their shirts off
kissing each other and, Mary and Joseph and baby Jesus outside in the cold.
Can someone explain this one to me?
Yes.
Pat Byrnes: Yeah.
I mean, Christmas and Christianity is out in the cold in Trump's world.
It's, it's ejected.
He's now at the center and him with his lover.
Daryl Cagle: So, and they refer to him
Dave Whamond: as Orange Jesus, as I, a lot in this world, so, This
one probably got a lot of reprints.
Daryl Cagle: I should say that A lot of people put it on their Christmas cards.
Yeah.
Through Kissing Kissing Putin on his nose.
In the second two years of the Trump administration, newspaper editors just
did not want to reprint Trump cartoons.
So you guys all know that because I sent you the stats on
cartoons are performing well.
And, I think it was just alarming the number of cartoons about
Trump that were being drawn.
and how few of those were getting reprinted.
when you, you look At the web, when we post our cartoons on social media,
the readers love the Trump cartoons.
And, you know, the reaction to this podcast.
We do Trump themed podcasts, and, they get all the traffic.
We do, climate change.
Nobody cares about climate change.
which is, frustrating to me.
A lot of, you know, the issues that I think are important.
I think climate change is important.
And, I don't get that from readers.
They don't care about it.
So, here's another one from Marion Kamensky in Austria with Trump, with his
long tie and the three, wise men on their camels standing on the tie, and Trump
doesn't like them standing on the tie.
And, it's cute and it's Trumpy.
I don't quite get a point, but, that's okay.
It's Christmas.
Rick McKee: You know, again, I think, to Pat's point, probably Trump wanting
to put himself at the center of everything, including and Christianity
and, you know, here are these guys.
You know, coming to see the baby Jesus and, and they're infringing upon him.
That's kind of what I think.
Bart van Leeuwen: I think it's even funny without, without the tie.
Because, when you say three wise men and there are four people depicted.
Yeah.
And one of them is dumb.
Daryl Cagle: I
Dave Whamond: also think it's weird associating Trump with religion.
The evangelicals love him.
I just, I can't wrap my head around
that.
Daryl Cagle: I've learned that the evangelical Christians don't
care one bit about hypocrisy.
They're fine with it.
it's, if
Pat Byrnes: you're on their side.
Otherwise, the slightest little flaw, they will hold against you.
Daryl Cagle: So here's Jimmy Margulies with, Trump Christmas red cup at
Starbucks, Starbucks, newest creation, the Trump whipped up controversy,
double shot of sanctimony foam at mouth.
Rick McKee: Similar to John Cole's.
it's good.
I like this little, like a little Trump Starbucks logo.
And this from
Pat Byrnes: 2015.
So this is, uh, yeah.
Oh,
Daryl Cagle: okay.
Oh yeah.
That's an early one.
How about that?
Here's Guy Parsons with Trump and Melania looking at a giant piece
of coal under their Christmas tree, and Trump says, It must be from
my friends in the coal industry.
It's a huge compliment.
They must love me bigly.
Pat Byrnes: And I'd believe that.
I would believe that.
Yes, I would believe anything he says.
Anything he says, because, you know, he's the chosen one.
Daryl Cagle: I should probably note that, given the, that we've limited
the metaphors in this to just Christmas metaphors that, we kind of see the same
topics coming up and, the cartoonists drawing the same thing, and that's okay.
'cause you draw it on a.
It's a different day in a different style, and it's a different
cartoon, and what the hell.
So, um,
Pat Byrnes: It's multiple perspectives.
And, there are only so many things to be said in the first place.
A lot of times they need repeating.
I, I got no
Daryl Cagle: problem with that.
think so too.
I, compare it to columnists and columnists don't get the bad attitude
that people have about cartoonists being repetitive because they're
just using words and you can't glance at it and see that it's similar.
But.
They do all write the same darn things at the same time And they use the same
arguments at the same time and they're getting talking points From party
headquarters and just choosing to write articles about that at the same time I
mean, there's a reason why these things all match Cartoonists do not get talking
points never heard of a cartoonist getting talking points for his cartoons
we tend to have normal attitudes about politics rather than following a
list of attitudes that we're supposed to have that comes from the party.
I think that's much healthier, and I think that people should, put a lot
more stock into the cartoonist pundits that they see on video podcasts than
any, darn duplicative columnists.
Rick McKee: I agree.
Dave Whamond: I also think,
with whatever's going on in the news, usually the first idea that
comes in your head, cartoonists are thinking the same thing I find.
So try to, you, whenever I do the first idea, it's like, okay, five or six others
that have done this, the same, you know.
Right.
Daryl Cagle: And here is, uh.
Kevin Siers with the Charlie Brown tree, which is a standard among cartoonists.
I think we've all drawn a Charlie Brown tree.
Pat Byrnes: But this is a very good, simple take on it.
Dave Whamond: Mm hmm.
Daryl Cagle: It is.
And gentlemen, that is our last cartoon.
Rick McKee: Oh, no.
Dave Whamond: I was saving up
all my good stuff.
Daryl Cagle: There were 40 of them!
40 is a lot!
This is a long podcast.
It just seemed to go by fast because it's so much fun.
Rick McKee: It is fun.
I had fun.
That's a great cartoon.
I love that.
That's one where you have to label, you know, you can't get around it.
Well, yeah,
Daryl Cagle: you're
Pat Byrnes: constricted to visual metaphor and Allegory.
So it's, it,
Dave Whamond: yeah, this one works.
Daryl Cagle: Yeah.
It's all good.
gentlemen, it's been, great to have you all here and, um, I
had a blast and we will all have a very merry Trump Christmas.
Wonderful.
I'm looking forward to
Rick McKee: Including me.
Yeah.
Good to, good
Dave Whamond: to
Daryl Cagle: meet you, all you guys.
Rick McKee: Season's greetings.
Nice to meet you.
Yeah.
Bart.
Pat.
Daryl Cagle: So, gentlemen, thank you all for being here.
thanks everyone for watching the Caglecast.
Please remember to subscribe to wherever you're listening to this.
And, I will see you next time.
gentlemen, thank you again.
much.
Thank
Rick McKee: you.
Bye bye.
See ya.